TRP 200: Three Trends in Business Development with Scott Love

[00:00:01] You're listening to The Rainmaking Podcast, hosted by high stakes headhunter, author and

[00:00:19] professional speaker, Scott Love.

[00:00:22] Hey, this is Scott Love with The Rainmaking Podcast.

[00:00:27] Our guest today is me again.

[00:00:28] Now, I know I did what's called a solo cast a few weeks ago, but this is our 200th episode.

[00:00:34] So I wanted to take the time to thank you and to all of our guests for making this

[00:00:38] show a huge success.

[00:00:40] We're a top 2% show on the podcast rankings.

[00:00:44] And I think part of it is because we have high quality guests on the show.

[00:00:48] We have a clear topic of rainmaking and topics related to rainmaking.

[00:00:52] And even though the show is industry agnostic, it really does lean towards those people

[00:00:57] in professional services who are responsible for getting clients to say yes.

[00:01:02] And that means everybody in a law firm, everybody in a recruiting firm or a staffing

[00:01:05] company and accounting firms, management consulting firms, investment banking firms

[00:01:10] and you name it. And those are our listeners.

[00:01:12] So thank you for making this a fantastic show.

[00:01:15] I'm really honored and I cherish that trust that you've placed in me.

[00:01:19] Now, our topic today is a summary of what I've learned.

[00:01:23] I'd say there are three main points that I've seen as a trend since I launched this

[00:01:27] show three and a half, almost four years ago.

[00:01:30] And then secondly, game theory and how you can use that to help your practice

[00:01:35] to predict what the future is going to be in terms of outcomes.

[00:01:39] So I would say that when I launched this after Covid, I had done other podcasting

[00:01:43] before. I'd actually been podcasting since 2007.

[00:01:47] But when we had guests on the show, that was when Covid had just happened.

[00:01:51] That was back in the day when you would reach out to a stranger and you would

[00:01:55] say, are you safe? How are you?

[00:01:58] And I think our entire society bonded together because we all went through a

[00:02:02] pretty severe situation at the same time.

[00:02:04] And that served as a bonding agent.

[00:02:05] So at that time, it was relatively easier to reach out to people because you had

[00:02:11] experienced an event together and you could talk about that.

[00:02:15] I think Covid helped us to quickly bring walls down when we're talking with

[00:02:20] strangers. And I think even I saw a trend on social media posts of

[00:02:25] vulnerability, especially on LinkedIn.

[00:02:28] Now, I'm not talking the type of vulnerability where you say my girlfriend

[00:02:31] dumped me and nobody wants to go out with me.

[00:02:34] I'm talking about I struggled with this, but this was the solution that I found

[00:02:37] and this is how I'd improve my practice.

[00:02:39] That's the kind of vulnerability I'm talking about.

[00:02:42] But there are three overarching trends that I saw took place over the last few

[00:02:46] years. And this is the common theme I've seen in the guests that I've had on

[00:02:50] the show. Number one is empathy.

[00:02:53] Being able to empathize and understand where somebody is, that serves as a

[00:02:58] bonding agent.

[00:03:00] Second was listening.

[00:03:02] If you understand how to communicate to people and how to be a good listener,

[00:03:08] then you can guide them forward and get intelligence that tells you what their

[00:03:11] pain points are and how you can move them forward to solve their problems by

[00:03:15] them working with you.

[00:03:17] Recently, I was the guest of the toughest audience I've ever spoken at,

[00:03:22] fifth graders, at the Binsley Elementary School Career Day.

[00:03:27] I did three different sessions of about 25 to 30 fifth graders talking about

[00:03:31] what is it like to pursue a career in business development or sales.

[00:03:35] And I talked about the key to success is to use your ears and your mouth and

[00:03:39] the proportion that you have them.

[00:03:41] How many years do you have?

[00:03:42] Two, they said.

[00:03:43] How many mouths do you have?

[00:03:44] One. You should use it in that relationship and that ratio.

[00:03:47] Listen, twice as much than what you say.

[00:03:50] I even was telling a group of people I was training on client development an

[00:03:54] example of how I use this to kind of get to know somebody.

[00:03:58] I was at a party and I met a professional there and he and his wife,

[00:04:02] they were talking with my wife and I.

[00:04:04] And the husband and I, we kind of walked off to the side so we could kind

[00:04:06] of get to know each other a little bit better.

[00:04:08] And he was a physician.

[00:04:09] He worked in plastic surgery.

[00:04:11] And sometimes I'll kind of play a game when I make a new friend and

[00:04:14] I'm going to ask them questions not to be intrusive but just to get to

[00:04:17] know them and see how long does it take for them to ask a question about me.

[00:04:21] And I think that if you're in sales or business development,

[00:04:24] you know that this is a good skill to develop.

[00:04:26] Getting to know people.

[00:04:27] Where do you live? How long you live there?

[00:04:29] How many kids do you have?

[00:04:30] How old are your kids? What schools are they in?

[00:04:32] How did you get into your profession?

[00:04:33] What are some of the things that you've seen are different now since

[00:04:36] COVID? Has that helped you?

[00:04:37] What's kind of your niche within your profession?

[00:04:40] And 20 minutes later he had to go.

[00:04:42] He didn't ask a single question and he shook my hand.

[00:04:45] He said, I've really enjoyed getting to know you.

[00:04:47] And that's how listening is.

[00:04:48] They can serve as a bonding agent.

[00:04:50] And when you listen and you empathize,

[00:04:53] that helps us to move the relationship forward.

[00:04:56] The third thing I've seen that's been a big change is that information

[00:05:00] is everywhere and business is hyper competitive.

[00:05:04] I spoke at a conference recently in the staffing industry and

[00:05:08] I was kind of working the room during my presentation.

[00:05:10] Tell me about business.

[00:05:11] It's tough. It's so tough.

[00:05:14] I said, well, I thought there was an increase in demand for talent.

[00:05:16] Absolutely. It's off the chart.

[00:05:17] People are looking for people.

[00:05:19] I said, well, isn't that what you want?

[00:05:21] They said, no, it's harder.

[00:05:23] Why is that? Because there's increased competition.

[00:05:25] And this lends me to the third point of distinction.

[00:05:29] So number one, empathy.

[00:05:30] Number two, listening.

[00:05:31] Number three, distinction.

[00:05:33] How can you show distinction in what you are all about?

[00:05:38] How does that distinction help you to become successful in selling your

[00:05:42] services?

[00:05:44] Recently I was talking with someone that was in the recruiting industry.

[00:05:48] He was struggling to find his way to get new clients because it's hyper

[00:05:53] competitive.

[00:05:54] And I said, well, what's unique about you?

[00:05:55] What's the first thing you can think of that's different about you?

[00:05:58] I used to be a professional tennis player.

[00:06:00] Tell me about that.

[00:06:01] I said there is a line of opportunity associated with that because you used

[00:06:06] to be a professional athlete.

[00:06:07] You perform at a high level, which means that you know how to focus,

[00:06:10] you know how to achieve results and you know how to deliver.

[00:06:13] I said you can use that distinction as a reason to help people see that

[00:06:17] you are the one they should work with.

[00:06:20] The question I have for you is what's distinct about you?

[00:06:23] What can you say about yourself that nobody else can say about themselves?

[00:06:26] And I'd be willing to bet that there is a line of a narrative that we can

[00:06:31] develop from that, which we can pull forward and use that as a way to

[00:06:36] bond with people.

[00:06:37] And I'll tell you this.

[00:06:38] People like people who are interesting and a little bit different.

[00:06:42] If everybody's all the same, it's just not interesting.

[00:06:45] Oh, wow, that's different.

[00:06:46] You're a professional athlete.

[00:06:47] Tell me about that.

[00:06:48] It's a way that you can bring the walls down and kind of break the ice,

[00:06:52] so to speak.

[00:06:53] And when I was at Binsley Elementary, I told them this is how you sell.

[00:06:57] You ask questions.

[00:06:58] I gave them examples of that.

[00:07:00] And one of the things we talked about was breaking the ice.

[00:07:03] How do you make a friend?

[00:07:05] And I even had one of the kids come up to the front of the class.

[00:07:07] We had kind of a role play about breaking the ice.

[00:07:09] How do you make friends with the stranger?

[00:07:11] Talk about the weather.

[00:07:13] Talk about current events.

[00:07:14] Oh, it sure is hot today.

[00:07:15] Did you see the ball game last night?

[00:07:17] And I talked about how in sales and client development,

[00:07:20] it's about developing effective people skills.

[00:07:23] And by the way, this school has a lot of kids whose parents

[00:07:27] came from someplace else based on where it's geographically situated.

[00:07:31] And our parish has that school as an outreach project.

[00:07:34] So it's exciting to get a chance to do that and be involved in that.

[00:07:37] It's very meaningful to me personally.

[00:07:39] And I even told them how many of my friends

[00:07:42] came from other countries with not a lot of resources.

[00:07:45] And they built something in this country.

[00:07:46] And that this is the land of opportunity.

[00:07:49] And it was really exciting to see that these kids understand that

[00:07:52] and that they understand that they could pursue a career

[00:07:55] in client development even later on in life.

[00:07:58] If they become an electrician, they might become a business

[00:08:00] developer for that electrical contractor at some point.

[00:08:03] But anyways, the school itself took the time

[00:08:07] to teach the kids the seven habits of highly effective people.

[00:08:11] Now, this was actually a program that they got the license to.

[00:08:13] But when I walked up to the school on the sidewalk leading to it,

[00:08:17] they had painted on there the seven habits.

[00:08:20] And we talked about that.

[00:08:22] And I asked them, tell me what some of them are.

[00:08:23] And I heard some of these fifth graders tell me things like,

[00:08:26] begin with the end in mind.

[00:08:28] Seek first to understand.

[00:08:30] It was so exciting to see that.

[00:08:32] But these are children that apparently the school had decided

[00:08:35] to teach them life skills.

[00:08:37] And those are the things that I think make someone successful

[00:08:40] in anything that they do.

[00:08:42] So getting back to client development, the three things

[00:08:45] that I've seen are the changes and the trends

[00:08:49] in being able to develop empathy with people,

[00:08:51] the need to listen more.

[00:08:53] And if you're in a competitive industry,

[00:08:56] what can you say that nobody else in the industry can say?

[00:08:59] What is that distinction?

[00:09:00] This is something I've even brought

[00:09:01] to my legal search practice.

[00:09:03] Sometimes when I meet with a law firm leader,

[00:09:05] I'll start with that.

[00:09:06] Tell me things that your firm can say about itself

[00:09:09] that nobody else can say about themselves.

[00:09:10] And you can't use the word culture

[00:09:12] because everybody's got great culture.

[00:09:13] That's table stakes now, everybody has it.

[00:09:16] And sometimes you would think that I've asked

[00:09:18] for a moment of silence when I asked that,

[00:09:20] but it forces them and me to get creative,

[00:09:23] to find that narrative that is truly distinct.

[00:09:27] That is something that's going

[00:09:28] to get the attention of people.

[00:09:29] By the way, read the book,

[00:09:31] Pitch Anything by Oram Clough.

[00:09:33] He talks about how you have to have something shiny,

[00:09:36] something new, something different

[00:09:38] to get people's attention.

[00:09:39] And that's a good way to start with that.

[00:09:41] So that's one trend that I've seen,

[00:09:43] empathy, listening and distinction,

[00:09:45] or three trends actually.

[00:09:47] Now let me switch gears for a little bit

[00:09:49] and talk about the recent concept

[00:09:50] that I developed for another recruiting firm.

[00:09:53] Now my core business is to recruit partners

[00:09:55] for law firms, especially corporate

[00:09:56] and private equity for big firms and major markets.

[00:09:59] But I also like speaking to groups

[00:10:01] on business development, especially recruiting groups.

[00:10:04] And some of the recruiting firms are just amazing

[00:10:06] with how they invest resources within their people.

[00:10:09] There's one group I helped to develop a concept

[00:10:12] of measuring key performance indicators.

[00:10:15] Those are the variables that lead

[00:10:17] to the outcomes we want.

[00:10:20] And it's important to gamify it.

[00:10:23] Now, I used to be a card counting blackjack player

[00:10:25] mentored by alumni of the MIT blackjack team years ago.

[00:10:28] But what that taught me, and I don't gamble anymore,

[00:10:30] but that taught me was that business is a game.

[00:10:33] And if we can make it a game,

[00:10:35] we're going to be more effective in our decision making.

[00:10:37] We're going to be more effective in our execution.

[00:10:40] And it's going to take the sting out of disappointment.

[00:10:42] Those are the three things that we get

[00:10:44] when we think of business as a game.

[00:10:46] So what I did was, because their whole focus

[00:10:49] was to increase business development effectiveness

[00:10:53] among their people.

[00:10:54] And some of them had never been

[00:10:55] in any sort of client development role before.

[00:10:58] So we looked at what are the key actions

[00:11:01] that lead up to getting a new client?

[00:11:03] Then I created a point system for it.

[00:11:05] Now, I got this idea years ago from Tony Bruno,

[00:11:08] a trainer married to Bar Bruno in the recruiting industry.

[00:11:11] He had what he called the 140 point system.

[00:11:13] And I use that every day.

[00:11:15] And that helped me to become successful.

[00:11:17] So I give a nod and recognition to Tony for his work.

[00:11:21] This is something that that inspired me over the years

[00:11:24] to come up with different variations of that

[00:11:25] for my own performance.

[00:11:27] But I did that for this other group

[00:11:29] where the goal is to make 100 points a day.

[00:11:31] And we're going to have different actions

[00:11:33] that lead up to the end result.

[00:11:35] For example, getting a signed agreement back from a client,

[00:11:40] that's worth 30 points.

[00:11:42] But getting a referral is worth 15 points.

[00:11:45] Wait a minute, why is getting a single referral

[00:11:47] worth half the price of getting an agreement back

[00:11:52] or half the value?

[00:11:53] Well, that's because each referral is so valuable

[00:11:55] because that could lead you to new opportunities.

[00:11:58] So if you set a goal to get a certain number of points,

[00:12:00] let's say 100 points every day,

[00:12:02] what are the actions that you can take to lead up to that?

[00:12:06] I'd recommend writing out all the inputs

[00:12:09] that lead up to it, assigning a point value

[00:12:12] and then track it and see what sort of success

[00:12:15] it leads to in terms of your business development efforts.

[00:12:19] Now in some professional services firms,

[00:12:21] this isn't going to be effective.

[00:12:23] In others, boy, you could create

[00:12:25] a whole system like this.

[00:12:26] And in fact, if you're interested in getting an example

[00:12:29] of what I've created, something that I've created

[00:12:31] for my own use, feel free to email me

[00:12:34] scottatattorneysearchgroup.com

[00:12:37] and mention the 100 point tool

[00:12:38] and I'll send that to you.

[00:12:40] No charge, just a gift, I wanted to help you with that.

[00:12:43] So think of the actions that lead up to the end result.

[00:12:47] How can you gamify that?

[00:12:49] One thing it'll help you do,

[00:12:50] like I mentioned in game theory,

[00:12:52] it helps you to make effective decisions.

[00:12:54] Well, if I spend more time in getting referrals,

[00:12:57] instead of other activities

[00:12:59] that don't have much results,

[00:13:00] so for example, sending an email to a cold client,

[00:13:02] that might be worth one point,

[00:13:04] but each referral by name is worth 15 points each.

[00:13:09] If you get three referrals from someone,

[00:13:11] that's 45 points, you're halfway to your goal for the day

[00:13:14] just by getting three referrals

[00:13:16] because that's how valuable that is.

[00:13:18] So you want to spend time in areas

[00:13:21] that add the most value.

[00:13:23] And by using a tool like this,

[00:13:25] it's going to teach you

[00:13:26] how to make effective decisions

[00:13:28] in terms of utilizing your time.

[00:13:30] Also, the more you spend time in areas

[00:13:33] that contribute the most to your success,

[00:13:35] you're going to increase your skills.

[00:13:37] It's going to increase effectiveness.

[00:13:40] And then third, like I said,

[00:13:42] it's going to take the sting out of disappointment

[00:13:44] when it's a game.

[00:13:45] We never lose as long as we learn things

[00:13:48] and I'd be willing to bet

[00:13:49] if you said I'm gonna use this every day

[00:13:51] for three weeks and if you measured it,

[00:13:53] keep an Excel spreadsheet at the end of the day,

[00:13:55] type in your points and see the trend,

[00:13:57] you're going to start getting better.

[00:13:59] Remember this, anything that can be measured

[00:14:01] improves over time.

[00:14:02] I was fortunate when I was 24

[00:14:04] to be a management consultant in the US Navy

[00:14:06] teaching Denning management methods,

[00:14:08] statistical charts and graphs,

[00:14:10] knowing that anything that contributes to the end goal,

[00:14:14] if we focus on improving the process,

[00:14:16] we will improve the results.

[00:14:18] Even client development is a process.

[00:14:20] It's not a one-time thing, it's an ongoing process.

[00:14:24] So let me know if that's a tool that can help you.

[00:14:26] And thank you again for taking the time to listen.

[00:14:29] We've got some exciting episodes coming up

[00:14:31] with some amazing guests,

[00:14:33] people that you may have already heard of

[00:14:35] here in the next few months.

[00:14:36] If you also have any suggestions of any coaches

[00:14:39] or authors or speakers on client development

[00:14:41] that you've come across,

[00:14:43] maybe they spoke at your partner retreat,

[00:14:45] maybe you saw them speak at a legal conference,

[00:14:47] please send me a note,

[00:14:49] scott at attorneysearchgroup.com

[00:14:51] and let me know about them,

[00:14:52] connect them with me on LinkedIn,

[00:14:53] I'm easy to find and I'd love to have them on the show.

[00:14:56] Thanks again for listening.

[00:14:57] And as always, this show is sponsored

[00:14:58] by Leopard Solutions Legal Intelligence Suite of Products,

[00:15:02] FirmScape and Leopard BI.

[00:15:04] Push ahead of the pack with the power of Leopard.

[00:15:10] Thank you for listening to the Rain Making Podcast.

[00:15:13] For more information about our recruiting services

[00:15:16] for international law firms,

[00:15:18] visit our website at attorneysearchgroup.com.

[00:15:22] To inquire about having Scott speak

[00:15:24] at your next convention,

[00:15:25] conference, sales meeting or executive retreat,

[00:15:29] visit therainmakingpodcast.com.